mohauk
Artisan
Bringer of Fish
Posts: 75
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Post by mohauk on Feb 2, 2007 18:48:23 GMT
Well, I'm new to the whole project but have read through all your previous work conclave-wise and here, and ideas have begun to sprout.
Think about it. You have hive-bergs, floating around on a sea of some sort of chemical fuel, filling themselves and then setting back at port to unfill. No doubt there is some serious wealth on board, in more subtle ways than actual dosh considering it is AdMech run. So it seems natural that pirates would flourish.
I'm once again reminded of mortal engines, because to survive out there long enough to raid and then evade the vengeance of floating hives jealously guarded by the admech, the pirates would have to dwell in soem sort of floating predatory townships, rickety constructions of girder and metal armour and shacks to live in. They'd be unomfortable and squalid but fast and well armed, I'd imagine. then, possibly, some hives might react by building defensive 'suburb (no word has ever fitted in with the Inquisitor background less) ships, to fight off such raids. they'd be better built but less expertly manned. And all these little town-ships could have small fleets of fast motorcraft dripping with guns.
Sorry for the rambling style, I'm trying to get my ideas out there how i saw them. Just some thoughts, anyway.
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Post by takaetun on Feb 2, 2007 19:49:21 GMT
Oh, I dunno, teddy bear comes in a close second. ...Mortal Engines... *drools* Thats a pretty good idea. They'd need a really major navy to take care of the whole thing, but I like the idea that this navy is Berg based rather than from a planetary authority. Some of the pirates could even by sponsored by rival hives to sabotage their rivals.
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Post by Doug on Feb 2, 2007 21:01:10 GMT
Ooh! I likey these ideas much....and agree with pretty much all of them...
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mohauk
Artisan
Bringer of Fish
Posts: 75
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Post by mohauk on Feb 3, 2007 8:06:58 GMT
Yes - in fact, the most probable reason why the AdMech (who are, after all, hardly known for their tact and gentleness) haven't just got some sort of ship (here meaning air+space, not sea), or a huge navy, to wipe out these pesky raiders, is that thye know at some point or other it'd be very useful to take someone else's hive down a notch.
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Post by thenephew on Feb 3, 2007 16:39:48 GMT
True - a mercenary faction of the pirates adds a degree of control of the Hives [other than economic blackmail] that the land based settlements can control. The problem with this is that a Hive is likely to have a sizable 'damage control' section of it's own, as well as some pretty high-end hardware. This would mean the pirates would need either an unrealistic level of technology, or ridiculous rates of staff turnover. Failing that, if this is an emerging threat, the Hives would have little in the way of defenses, this having previously been a peaceful world. Unfortunately, I don't think that one is very likely.
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Post by Doug on Feb 3, 2007 17:43:48 GMT
Well, a previously peaceful world, save for civil wars and the odd off world attack...
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vendile
Enginseer
The doodler
Posts: 234
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Post by vendile on Feb 4, 2007 1:21:06 GMT
pirates? attacking a hive-bergs that varie from a kilometre to fifteen kilometers across? I think your bonkers.
all due respect, Mortal Engines is a good book, and whilst i can understand the direct you are coming from - this is not the world of Mortal Engines with towns being 'eaten' by larger cities.
However - i do think that the PDF should have large seaborn craft - perhaps a couple "war-bergs" as their planetary base, with a reasonable sized fleet of other ocean-going vessels.
Going back to pirates though - the main problem i have with them on this world is that the only way it would work is with the trading ships that re-supply the hive-bergs. But why would they bother with piracy when they can make a perfectly stabel and profitable living transporting essential supplies which they sell to the hive-bergs in exchange for the 'resource', which they then take to the mainland and sell to off-world traders, before buying more supplies arriving from off-world.
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Post by Doug on Feb 4, 2007 9:29:25 GMT
Perfectly stable? With respect, I imagine monotonously transporting the resource and supplies back and forth over the undoubtedly dangerous and treacherous oceans would be anything but stable - and profitable would depend on the season, how many boats were operational at thge time, your league, etc. No, transport work would be about as easy as fishing in the North Sea - which I'm told is incredibly hard work.
As for why people become pirates, couldn't the same question be asked in RL? People can lead a perfectly stable living on the seas without turning to piracy today, so why do people do it? I'm not a pirate, so I can't speak personally, but I imagine it's something to do with the fact they imagine (at least) that its quicker, easier, more exciting and often more profitable.
You do, however raise the perfectly correct point that the pirates would, if anything, generally be targeting supply ships - and I agree. To be fair, the economic leverabe pooint still does exist though - you could collapse a hive's economy by cutting off its supplies, in much the same manner as you could by cutting off their accessto the space port.
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Post by inquisitorarantel on Feb 4, 2007 12:18:45 GMT
The Pirates could have good equipment if they get lots and lots of money and buy it in the Cove. Aftyer all, they could probably pretend to be the supply ships and say something like, "We're buying this to defend ourselves- there are dangerous pirates about!" Enter the pirates with laspistols and chain-cutlasses.
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Post by Doug on Feb 4, 2007 12:20:27 GMT
As well as stealing it from ships eager to defend themselves against the pirate menace...
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Post by inquisitorarantel on Feb 4, 2007 12:24:04 GMT
They would probably also have some kind of submersible and/ or diving equipment, so they can attach stuff below the waterline in order to get in or for sabotage ppurposes.
In fact (just to get yet another Mortal Engines reference in before anyone else does...), they could have submersibles that attach themselves to the bottoms of ships as their primary mode of transport...
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Post by Doug on Feb 4, 2007 12:29:57 GMT
Hmmm...while the submersibles for sabotage seems like a good idea, I'm very iffy about them being their main mode of transport - I suspect trawlers are going to notice a lump of metal clumped onto them...that, and the tech level for that's probably going to be beyond pirates unless they have a rogue AdMech with them...and I'm not sure it feels appropriately 40k anyway, if you know what I mean. But I can see some better equipped groups using them in the right circumstances, like sabotage, as you suggest...
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vendile
Enginseer
The doodler
Posts: 234
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Post by vendile on Feb 4, 2007 13:18:52 GMT
i don't like the idea of common everyday imperial citizens having access to be using submersibles, it just seems wrong - i'm sure the admech would have some for maintenance purposes, but apart from that it just seems slightly wrong.
tho I can understand the extremly rich having access to that type of thing, but nothing that goes very deep. People would stick to surface craft in my opinion - easier to control an generally safer, even if there is the very occassional pirate.
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Post by thenephew on Feb 4, 2007 16:51:16 GMT
A few 3-4 man assault subd, that are used to get in close and try to start an attack relatively stealthily is reasonable for a gang of fairly successful pirates. Living underwater when your food supply, let alone rare spare part supply, is unpredictable, is getting a little too far into the realms of unlikelyhood. Snow Crash, by Neal Stephenson, has an excellent idea of what an 'unofficial trade company' would do at sea - buy up a few old tankers, convert them to living space, acquire some speedboats and heavy machineguns and a weilding torch... The problem is that, by the time a pirate force has the power to be a serious threat to either Bergs or regular shipping lanes, it has an entire detachment of marine mobile PDF up its ass with boarding cannons and air support.
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vendile
Enginseer
The doodler
Posts: 234
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Post by vendile on Feb 4, 2007 17:26:19 GMT
1) They would probably have be alot more than just "fairly successful" to aquire a sub in my opinion. For one thing, they would need a ship capabile of taking it out of the water.
2) the converting tankers things is what was in my mind as to the type of thing they might do - though i am still not really in favour of the pirate idea at the moment.
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